Too Much Bait

[YETI-14]

Is there such hing as too much bait? I was on JPP in Hamilton Creek from 3:30 until dark yesterday. There was so much bait that the fish were completely scattered. My fish finder was lighting up like a scoreboard but no takers.

[fairweatherfisherman]

Not just JPP. I was in a creek arm of one of our Georgia lakes on the Chattahoochee River yesterday, and it had bait everywhere. The speculation I’ve heard is that there have not been the shad kills due to the last couple of warm winters. I don’t know if you are a bait guy or artificials, but I found that a free lined shad, with just a 1/0 hook tied direct to 10 pound mono worked pretty well.

[Texas_Rig]

My most frustrating days are when there is bait everywhere and fish blowing up everywhere and not being able to get bit. A couple years ago in the fall, I was fishing OH. I was fishing a little flat pocket in a creek that had bait everywhere. There would be several fish constantly busting bait on the surface in all directions. I spent several days in there trying to figure out how to catch those fish. I would catch one every now and then, but I never could figure out how to catch those fish.

[agelesssone]

Originally Posted by Texas_Rig

My most frustrating days are when there is bait everywhere and fish blowing up everywhere and not being able to get bit. A couple years ago in the fall, I was fishing OH. I was fishing a little flat pocket in a creek that had bait everywhere. There would be several fish constantly busting bait on the surface in all directions. I spent several days in there trying to figure out how to catch those fish. I would catch one every now and then, but I never could figure out how to catch those fish.

Most guys want to throw too big of a bait. When your graph is full of bait so thick the graph can't read bottom, the bait is usually very small.
I'm catching most of my fish (LM, whites, and hybrids) on two inch swim baits.
I troll A-rigs and put 2 inch Powerbait swimbaits on them.
My three, four, and five inch swimmers weren't getting hit, so I threw a cast net one day to see what the bait was like. My 3/8 mesh net kept coming in empty even though my graph was full of bait. So one day I took my creek cast net (1/4 inch mesh, multifilament) and threw it at the mess on the graph. I had so many 1-2 inch shad in it, I could hardly pick it up. I didn't bring the shad into the boat, just shook most of the bait out. I pulled in a few just to get a good look. That is what made.me downsize my baits and really upped.my catch ratio.

[Heiny57]

Yep you are right Merv, I took your advice today and put the 2” swim baits on the smaller of my only 2 A-rigs I own , and 3” on the other larger one. We lost a really good one on the bigger rig and landed a couple smaller hybrids on the smaller rig. The bait in Hamilton went from the bottom , 30 ft, to 3 feet from the top more than once. There is no lack of bait in the creeks.

I ordered 6 rigs on eBay. What length do you use Merv?

[Heiny57]

Originally Posted by fairweatherfisherman

Not just JPP. I was in a creek arm of one of our Georgia lakes on the Chattahoochee River yesterday, and it had bait everywhere. The speculation I’ve heard is that there have not been the shad kills due to the last couple of warm winters. I don’t know if you are a bait guy or artificials, but I found that a free lined shad, with just a 1/0 hook tied direct to 10 pound mono worked pretty well.

I would agree with that assessment. I may try live bait next time if I can catch any large enough.

[agelesssone]

Originally Posted by Heiny57

Yep you are right Merv, I took your advice today and put the 2” swim baits on the smaller of my only 2 A-rigs I own , and 3” on the other larger one. We lost a really good one on the bigger rig and landed a couple smaller hybrids on the smaller rig. The bait in Hamilton went from the bottom , 30 ft, to 3 feet from the top more than once. There is no lack of bait in the creeks.

I ordered 6 rigs on eBay. What length do you use Merv?

Since I'm not clear on the question, I'll show you the rig that I use.

The first photo is a stock A-rig that I order from China, approximately $3.00 each. I only use the ones with blades as I feel the extra flash triggers the fish.

You can see the size of snap swivel that comes stock. A 4 lb hybrid will open that thing up like a rubber band. I've placed one of the replacement snaps next to it for comparison. Ten pounders can't open these.

I then cut the snap/swivels off of the three arms that will get the baits and replace them with the heavier snaps, swivels and split rings. I leave the stock snap swivels on the two that will get the teasers.

For teasers, I just open the stock snap, run it through the nose of a small swimbait and close the snap. Sometimes you'll lose a teaser due to a fish striking it, but that's just the price of having the fish hit your lure.

Photo #2 is the finished product that I fish with. The color head doesn't seem to make any difference.

Since I wasn't clear as to the question of length, I enclosed photo #3 with the rig laid out on a ruler.

Hope this answers any questions y'all might have.

A few guides may take umbrage with me giving details out such as these but there are more fish in the lakes that will NEVER see one of these lures so I don't feel bad by helping fellow fishermen catch a fish or two.

Just remember when you have one of those 50-60 fish days, go to my website, nashvillefishingguideS.com and leave a nice review!

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[Dakota]

Thanks Merv great info. Same true at the steam plant right now with down sizing. Like I mentioned I caught everything last time out on a trout magnet.


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[Heiny57]

Thanks Merv for the great info. Sorry I wasn’t clear, I was after the overall length and you showed that perfectly . I have the right ones on the way. What type of line do you like? Do you use braid?

Thanks for helping this weekend warrior catch a few more when I can get out.
I do throw your name out when I talk fishing with people.

Thanks again
Bob

[agelesssone]

[QUOTE=Heiny57;80149]Thanks Merv for the great info. Sorry I wasn’t clear, I was after the overall length and you showed that perfectly . I have the right ones on the way. What type of line do you like? Do you use braid?

Thanks for helping this weekend warrior catch a few more when I can get out.
I do throw your name out when I talk fishing with people.

Thanks again
I troll using 80# braid. There are a lot of trees in Priest.
By using 80#, I can straighten the hooks and retrieve the A-rig.

[Alphahawk]

Originally Posted by agelesssone

Most guys want to throw too big of a bait. When your graph is full of bait so thick the graph can't read bottom, the bait is usually very small.

I'm catching most of my fish (LM, whites, and hybrids) on two inch swim baits.

I troll A-rigs and put 2 inch Powerbait swimbaits on them.

My three, four, and five inch swimmers weren't getting hit, so I threw a cast net one day to see what the bait was like. My 3/8 mesh net kept coming in empty even though my graph was full of bait. So one day I took my creek cast net (1/4 inch mesh, multifilament) and threw it at the mess on the graph. I had so many 1-2 inch shad in it, I could hardly pick it up. I didn't bring the shad into the boat, just shook most of the bait out. I pulled in a few just to get a good look. That is what made.me downsize my baits and really upped.my catch ratio.

Merv is spot on here. I fish a lot different than most people. I don’t usually target strippers or hybrid...but I do white bass. If I am catching whites off of a big bait ball down at Pickwick on the Trout Magnet, and stripers move in on it, I quit throwing the Trout Magnet.....don’t want to get spooled by a 10 pound striper using 2# test line. They will hit it in a situation like that every time. Same with any other specie I know of when they are feeding on a bait ball. Back in 2002 an event happened below dam at Pickwick that I have only seen once. There were literally thousands of stripers that covered acres below the dam at Pickwick. This feeding frenzy went on for hours in bright sunlight. There were about 10 boats out there that day and the striper were busting so much I thought they were literally going to jump in the boat.....schoolies as the term I learned from TK. None of us were catching a thing. All of us were casting but no catching. Finally got one fish to hit out of all of that. Didn’t know then what I know now....we were all casting baits too big. That was back before I downsized tackle and lures.


Regards


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[Texas_Rig]

Originally Posted by agelesssone

Most guys want to throw too big of a bait. When your graph is full of bait so thick the graph can't read bottom, the bait is usually very small.
I'm catching most of my fish (LM, whites, and hybrids) on two inch swim baits.
I troll A-rigs and put 2 inch Powerbait swimbaits on them.
My three, four, and five inch swimmers weren't getting hit, so I threw a cast net one day to see what the bait was like. My 3/8 mesh net kept coming in empty even though my graph was full of bait. So one day I took my creek cast net (1/4 inch mesh, multifilament) and threw it at the mess on the graph. I had so many 1-2 inch shad in it, I could hardly pick it up. I didn't bring the shad into the boat, just shook most of the bait out. I pulled in a few just to get a good look. That is what made.me downsize my baits and really upped.my catch ratio.

Thx for the info Merv. I will certainly downsize in that situation next time.

[YETI-14]

Thanks for the insight MERV 👍

[jaybird]

I have had the same issues with the China made stuff Merv is talking about. Had a jigging spoon hook just destroyed by a 14 inch white two weekends ago. The metal is week. Thanks to Merv for the idea on how to get around the issues with the a-rigs. I have some of those I have not used yet and sounds like I need to repair them first