****** Creek

[Doc Marshall]

Hi Guys,

Looking at a map I decided to check out ****** Creek. I found a few places to access the bank at ******. Tossed a bunch of rooster tails, my go-to river lure, and didn't get a single hit.

I'd heard that the water was pretty polluted, but it was clear and there was a good current. As clear as the water was, I didn't see anything swimming in there - not even a single bluegill hovering near the shore. I hear it used to hold some smallmouth....are there any fish in there?

I might give it a try with nightcrawlers just to get the confidence up.

Anyway, it was scenic (the trash notwithstanding) and relatively close to home, so I thought it would be a decent place to cast on a warm day. Does anyone have any info?

[white95v6]

I used to fish it between *******. I caught both largemouth and smallmouth. And lots of bluegill.

[creeksmallie]

There are no fish in creeks in Middle TN. They were once a treasured fishery that could be easily fished out. Now there are no fish in creeks because people started naming the creeks on the internet and they became fished out. Pollution is an excuse please thank that all creeks and small rivers are polluted. If a longtime member of this site wants to know about a small body of water/creek just pm me. Sorry to be a smart!@!#%#$@. But I have seen some great waters fished out because of the bucket brigades. I still have many creeks that produce 20 inch smallmouth on a regular basis but I do not share the name on a public forum.
Mike

[Tennoutdrsman]

Doc,
Ok,The area ******* is good and fishing is pretty good all the way to Harding place..Flukes are a fav of the bass,they LOVE them.Bluegill fishing is great too.Good luck!

[bd-]

I really don't believe in "naming names" on small creeks - maybe the people posting here believe in catch and release, but there are plenty of "meat hunters" out there who view but don't post, and they can take more fish out of a small creek than it can sustain.

But I'll let this thread stand since ****** is an urban stream and gets a lot of traffic anyway. I'll say two things:

1. Since the Greenway was built, ****** isn't the creek it used to be. It has been impacted significantly by the "meat hunters" referenced above, taking bass out on stringers.

2. I wouldn't bother with ****** or any other small creek in the winter between November and March. Some of the fish migrate out into deeper waters, and others take cover and almost go into a state of hibernation, but either way, my experience has been that fishing in small creeks stinks in the winter. If you can find a very deep "wintering hole" you may catch some fish, but generally speaking, the payoff isn't worth the effort.

[tkwalker]

I really don't believe in "naming names" on small creeks - maybe the people posting here believe in catch and release, but there are plenty of "meat hunters" out there who view but don't post, and they can take more fish out of a small creek than it can sustain.

But I'll let this thread stand since ****** is an urban stream and gets a lot of traffic anyway. I'll say two things:

1. Since the Greenway was built, ****** isn't the creek it used to be. It has been impacted significantly by the "meat hunters" referenced above, taking bass out on stringers.

2. I wouldn't bother with ****** or any other small creek in the winter between November and March. Some of the fish migrate out into deeper waters, and others take cover and almost go into a state of hibernation, but either way, my experience has been that fishing in small creeks stinks in the winter. If you can find a very deep "wintering hole" you may catch some fish, but generally speaking, the payoff isn't worth the effort.


Folks, bd and Mike Dial (CreekSmallie, prof. Guide) know what they are talking about ... Your sweet fishing hole may be in Jeopardy ... There are fisherman, legal lic. , and illegal no lic,(state or Federal) that could care less about limits, or trashing our environment ... In this day in time "It is all about Me !!" <'TK><:(

[jad2t]

As much as I love talking to and getting to meet and fish with the awesome people on this forum, I really wish you guys would give it a rest already with the "meat hunter", "bucket brigade", etc. references. It's a bit obnoxious.

[tkwalker]

:)As much as I love talking to and getting to meet and fish with the awesome people on this forum, I really wish you guys would give it a rest already with the "meat hunter", "bucket brigade", etc. references. It's a bit obnoxious.

So, You don't believe they are out there. Since you are a 30 year old fisherman who has a Middle Tennessee knowledge of our fisheries ... tell me your experinences why they are not out there and that We are obnoxious !! <'TK><

[jad2t]

It's the double standard that's annoying. Either you are ok with people eating fish or you're not. Picking and choosing what bodies of water and what species of fish are acceptable is not a logical argument. BD commented about people taking a stringer of bass. Well the limit is 5 isn't it? Taking a stringer of 5 bass is within the legal limit so it's not an issue. Pollution probably has a lot more to do with the fish population struggling in local streams than does harvesting fish. Nature has it's way of replenishing the source unless you have hundreds of people a week pulling a limit out of a small stream which I'm pretty sure isn't happening. The trash being dumped into the rivers, being left behind by sloppy fishermen I think is a lot more destructive to the fishery than the occasional limit being pulled out of the stream.

[tkwalker]

It's the double standard that's annoying. Either you are ok with people eating fish or you're not. Picking and choosing what bodies of water and what species of fish are acceptable is not a logical argument. BD commented about people taking a stringer of bass. Well the limit is 5 isn't it? Taking a stringer of 5 bass is within the legal limit so it's not an issue. Pollution probably has a lot more to do with the fish population struggling in local streams than does harvesting fish. Nature has it's way of replenishing the source unless you have hundreds of people a week pulling a limit out of a small stream which I'm pretty sure isn't happening. The trash being dumped into the rivers, being left behind by sloppy fishermen I think is a lot more destructive to the fishery than the occasional limit being pulled out of the stream.

Jimmy, you have been a great member since 2009 with 384 post ... Good point taken ! ... I don't think the issue here is a double standard ... the true Tennessee fishermen here will do what is legal, and will keep the legal limit ... No problem there ... I know you have followed my philosophy on catch and release if it is legal so be it ... It is the Illegals that bothers me ...

Here is the rub ... All of the above bd, and Mike over the last two decades plus myself ... Have witnessed (since I am not a politically correct person, I will get to the point) have witnessed Asians catching a limit and taking them to their car, and returning many times to do the same... In fact turned them in and they were found guilty and had to pay $100 ea. for every over the limit fish !! ... As well as Latinos, on all of the creeks and streams that has been mentioned above as well as the Caney Fork, Stones river etc... And trash city when they leave ... If you want your Honey hole rapped .. go ahead and advertise it !! <'TK><

Jimmy's Quote "Pollution probably has a lot more to do with the fish population struggling in local streams than does harvesting fish. Nature has it's way of replenishing the source unless you have hundreds of people a week pulling a limit out of a small stream which I'm pretty sure isn't happening. The trash being dumped into the rivers, being left behind by sloppy fishermen I think is a lot more destructive to the fishery than the occasional limit being pulled out of the stream." Jimmy.... You have got your head in the sand !! ... <'TK><

[MNfisher]

I strongly believe those small streams can easily be fished out by legally taking limits with consistency. I keep fish, my wife and I love eating fish, but there are some waters I fish that I will NEVER keep fish. If I want a meal, I don't fish those areas. They are just too fragile.

[nomad60]

I think I've mentioned this before, but I too have seen what careless fishing can rapidly do to a body of water. I started fishing this lake in Korea back in 2003 or so

https://maps.google.com/?ll=37.120633,127.209063&spn=0.043869,0.090895&t=h&z=14

It's not a huge lake, nothing like the ones here, but it was pretty good size. This was before bass fishing became popular over in Korea. I could go to that lake and catch anywhere from 10-20 bass in the 1-3 pound range per day, almost every day I went and this was all from shore. I could also walk the shore with an ultralight and a 1/16 oz rooster tail, and catch 25-50 slab-size bluegill. This was all catch and release.
Then, bass fishing became popular over there, and within 3 years, I was lucky to catch a 1-pound bass or 2. Every now and then, I'd luck out and catch a nice one but more or less, the lake got fished out because along with finding out about the sport of bass fishing, people also found out that bass taste good (and bluegill too). And with no creel limits or conservation laws, folks kept everything they caught.
Now having said that, I have nothing against those who choose to fish and keep their legal limits. If I ever figure out the danged crappie, I'll be doing the same whenever I can. But the ones who think it's their right to keep every single fish they catch, regardless of size, laws or regs, they sicken me.

[Travis C.]

This is one of those chicken and the egg topics that go around year after year.

I agree with bd/Mike on naming names for the smalls streams but that is my view point due to seeing it happen on one of my favorite streams.

I agree with Jimmy on legal is legal no matter how you chalk it up. But, for every stream that is being out fished there are other bodies of water that with some leg work are in need of fish to be taken out because of population control.

There is common ground in there somewhere it's just up to the individual to find it. Next time you fish that little body of water think about the impact pros/cons or try to get a map out and see if you can find a new one. A bunch of farm ponds are full of fish that never get attention. All it may take is the courtesy of just asking or offering a hand to do something for them in return.

[jaycee]

Legal vs illegal

Fifteen or so years ago the stripe/white bass were so thick in the Stones Rivers, East and West Forks, they could be caught on a shiney hook in the spring.

Then came the illegals. Below Walterhill Dam and Nices Mill Dam in the spring. I have seen cast nets, trap nets and seine nets that reach almost across the river as well as fishing and no culls.

Stripe population is way way down.

Don't believe me? Follow some of the guys that park on Florence Road into the woods down the path that leads to West Fork narrows. Near Nices Mill Dam on road behind Nissan.

Good thing is they also keep yellow bass.

Oh, and by the way, I am firm belielver of keeping fish to eat. And I not only keep fish but help feed others at the Walterhill Country Club. Crappie, Bream and Catfish caught in the large rivers and lake, not from the small creeks.

[jad2t]

You guys are getting off topic. Of course we all hate the Asians and Mexicans that keep small/too many fish they caught using nets. Hey TK, how's that for political correctness haha.

Certain people on this forum, who will remain nameless, absolutely hate the thought of someone keeping a trout or a bass from any body of water. Don't believe me? Look up the thread where a member posted a video of a guy fishing below a huge dam (I don't remember where it was) and caught a 4lb smallie and put it in the cooler. People wanted to burn him alive for doing such a thing. That was no middle TN stream was it? I'm so sick of those kind of people whining about fishermen who want to keep their legal limit. Guys like me, who hold a valid license every year and absolutely never break the rules. If I want to keep a big smallie, I'm doing to do it. I don't care if I catch it in Center Hill Lake, or some tiny stream in Smyrna, it's mine.

TK - You claim my head is in the sand about fish population being more heavily affected by pollution. Is it? Check out the scientific articles about birth control hormones in our water causing fish to undergo sex changes from male to female. How can a stream full of female fish repopulate?

[tkwalker]

You guys are getting off topic. Of course we all hate the Asians and Mexicans that keep small/too many fish they caught using nets. Hey TK, how's that for political correctness haha.

Certain people on this forum, who will remain nameless, absolutely hate the thought of someone keeping a trout or a bass from any body of water. Don't believe me? Look up the thread where a member posted a video of a guy fishing below a huge dam (I don't remember where it was) and caught a 4lb smallie and put it in the cooler. People wanted to burn him alive for doing such a thing. That was no middle TN stream was it? I'm so sick of those kind of people whining about fishermen who want to keep their legal limit. Guys like me, who hold a valid license every year and absolutely never break the rules. If I want to keep a big smallie, I'm doing to do it. I don't care if I catch it in Center Hill Lake, or some tiny stream in Smyrna, it's mine.

TK - You claim my head is in the sand about fish population being more heavily affected by pollution. Is it? Check out the scientific articles about birth control hormones in our water causing fish to undergo sex changes from male to female. How can a stream full of female fish repopulate?

Jimmy, in fact I was dicussing this with our fellow member who stocks ponds ... There are a lot of variables to the reason this happens ...it has a lot to do with the species of fish ...

What I was referring to, that statistically if the fishery (in this case a small creek or lets even say the East Fork on the Stones River) Or the Caney ... If it is a stocked species' and if that area is over fished of that species. Your Honey Hole will be a slow go until it does replenish...

And what we are saying it has nothing to do with catch and release but most of these creeks and streams that have been mentioned here are usually fished by multitudes of Bank Fisherman ... Who pays no attention to limits, Nor the trash they leave behind ... I've even witnessed Cast nets being thrown and everything in it hauled to the truck, multiple times ... <'TK><

[jad2t]

I'm with you guys 100% on the illegals using cast nets and what not, even fishing with rods but still keeping undersized fish. I've called TWRA multiple times to report it and unfortunately nothing gets done. The trash irritates me too. People don't have any respect for the beautiful fisheries that God gave us and that's a shame.

I'm not talking about small streams though. I can guarantee you that if I was to take a 24 inch brown out of the Caney for dinner (as soon as I catch one you can believe it's going into some hot olive oil) and posted about it, rather than congratulating me on such an awesome fish, I'd catch heat for keeping it instead of releasing it. That's my gripe.

[agelesssone]

I go fishing yesterday in 25 degree weather and 15 MPH winds. I catch 14"-14 3/4" saugers that I throw back because the SIZE LIMIT is 15 inches. As I am looking at the measuring board, the two beautiful filets I am fixing to release, I have to do a self examination. Do you follow the rules or not. There's probably not a TWRA person within fifty miles, I haven't seen another boat on the water, TWRA will be checking out the duck hunters because they are understaffed as it is and can't police every boat ramp in their territory.

1/4 of an inch is not much.....but it is the difference between living with myself or dealing with a bad conscience. When does it become too far undersized to keep? 1/2 inch? 3/4 inch? To me it doesn't matter if it is an inch under or 1/8 inch under, it goes back. I know a number of people who just look at a fish and say, "Yeah, that's legal" and throw it in the livewell.

Since I feel the laws are there for a reason, the undersized fish goes overboard. Instead of coming home with six or seven fish, I came home with three....and didn't look back. People who know me personally know if a crappie is 9 7/8", a bass on PP is 14 13/16", or a sauger is 14 3/4", they go back in the lake/river/water. Having said all that, I have to say this....if I catch and want to keep a limit of legal sized fish, be it LM SM, crappie, white bass, sauger, walleye or catfish, I will do so and have no qualms about it.

People here in Tennessee revere the smallmouth bass whereas in Canada it is akin to our carp, it's considered a trash fish. It's only saving grace is it's good for a shore lunch. Myself, I give a crap about a smallmouth and, if I caught one that was legal size and wanted to keep it, I would and would vigorously defend my right to do so against any self righteous individual who wanted to challenge me on it.

BUT! When I see the "bucket brigade" throwing cast nets, hauling in shad, white bass, and or crappie and everything goes in the bucket/livewell, regardless of size, yes, I get outraged and incensed. Too bad we can't have the old "citizens arrest" take place there on the shoreline.

[agelesssone]

And Jimmy I agree with you. If you catch, photograph, and post a photo of a 24" brown trout and then post photos of it in the frying pan, you WILL BE castigated, spit on, called many unsavory names, have your sanity questioned, be labeled an eco-terrorist, and unjustly be stricken from many sportsmen's invite list.

Myself on the other hand would ask you if it was delicious and were you thinking of sharing!

[MNfisher]

Jimmy, first of all, you are a great person, I enjoyed fishing with you and look forward to doing so again in the future, but there is a large difference in keeping a 24" trout in the caney or a 20" smallie from center hill than keeping a 20" smallie from a small stream, there might only be one 20" smallie in a 1 mile section of that stream, once it's gone, it's gone. There are several large trout in the caney and large bass in our reservoirs, but the small streams, which was the original topic in this thread, can and will get fished out if people keep the bass they catch there.

As far as the 24" brown, eat away. There are several in the river and most of the general public will probably not catch many if any at all. 99% of the few guys who can consistently bring in big browns are releasing them. I said 99%, I know some do eat them. I have tried to catch big brown for a whole, I have gotten several from 18-23 1/2", none over 24 yet.


Again I have absolutely no problem with keeping a limit of anything....until I see you walking up the bank of a 20' wide stream dragging a limit of bass.....just my 2 cents:)

[MNfisher]

And yes, if you post a pic of a big dead trout, you will get bombarded. Not by me, but it will happen. Trout in TN are like Musky in MN. If someone knifed a 50" musky in MN, there is a possibility they would get thrown in a ditch and beaten! Ha!

[Travis C.]

I think we are bouncing around between a few different topics in here.

The first issue brought up was posting specific creeks names on a public forum. They simply can't stand a huge amount of fish taking without a noticeable impact on the populations and it is more of a problem than you might think. It's just a smaller ecosystem than a lake or river and this site gets major traffic through it.

Non-licensed anglers regardless of ethnic background "illegals" if you must say should be reported whether we feel the TWRA can act on it that particular time or not. Keep in mind statewide it would average out to about 1 agent per county if I remember correctly. You can imagine the job that would take. They are not only responsible for fish/game violations but also boating violations and have to help in meth/drug cases in the backwoods too.

As far as the example of the big trout Jimmy, take that with a grain of salt and not personally...be proud of the accomplishment. Remember there are fisherman who target and treasure many different species not just trout then may eat others or not at all. Some may take just as much offense to a nice bass taken home as a trout or say if you treasure that huge rockfish then some else may see it as food but you see as a trophy. Everyones wired differently and has different goals I just try to respect them as much as I can. The old saying "One man's trash is another man's treasure" is pretty universal in all things.

[tkwalker]

And Jimmy I agree with you. If you catch, photograph, and post a photo of a 24" brown trout and then post photos of it in the frying pan, you WILL BE castigated, spit on, called many unsavory names, have your sanity questioned, be labeled an eco-terrorist, and unjustly be stricken from many sportsmen's invite list.

Myself on the other hand would ask you if it was delicious and were you thinking of sharing!

Agelessone, Your story reminded me of a similar situation that happened some years back . My brother was with me below Cordell Hull Dam one chilly evening and I was throwing my Cast net for bait ... And when I brought it to the surface and started unloading it; there laid about 5 pound walleye just flopping around. After loading my live wells with bait ... I reached down and pitched the Big Eye overboard with no hesitation.

I thought my brother was going to croak there on the spot. He said what the Hell did you do that for !!! I had that already filleted and steaked out and in the oil !!! I looked at and said ... Yep it would have been good ... But My conscience would not let live with myself and it wouldn't have tasted near as good to me. I told him it was illegal to catch and keep game fish with a net ... <'TK><:)

[old sailor]

I can guarantee you that if I was to take a 24 inch brown out of the Caney for dinner (as soon as I catch one you can believe it's going into some hot olive oil) and posted about it, rather than congratulating me on such an awesome fish, I'd catch heat for keeping it instead of releasing it. That's my gripe.[/QUOTE]

Gee thats too bad; I haven't eaten one of those bad boys since sunday.

[agelesssone]

LMAO at old sailor! I wouldn't eat one if I caught it. It'd be like eating a carp to me cause I just don't like trout......or catfish.....or rockfish.....or white bass.

But Bass!! Spots, largemouth, smallies! If it's legal, it's getting dunked in an olive oil hot tub! Crappie and bluegill too!

[tkwalker]

I'm with you guys 100% on the illegals using cast nets and what not, even fishing with rods but still keeping undersized fish. I've called TWRA multiple times to report it and unfortunately nothing gets done. The trash irritates me too. People don't have any respect for the beautiful fisheries that God gave us and that's a shame.

I'm not talking about small streams though. I can guarantee you that if I was to take a 24 inch brown out of the Caney for dinner (as soon as I catch one you can believe it's going into some hot olive oil) and posted about it, rather than congratulating me on such an awesome fish, I'd catch heat for keeping it instead of releasing it. That's my gripe.

This battle between what is legal by law and the release concept was really set in motion in the late 60's and early 70's when the BASS Tourneys started up and has perpetuated. Heck when I was a kid no one threw anything back ... You have seen the old pic's of stringers of bass being held up for a pic.. In fact I have a 1972 Corps Lake map with such a pic on it ... But what gets me ... There were more larger fish caught then than now ?!

So since the 60's to present ... 5 decades this has been going on ...

My opinion " if it is legal and it itches scratch it" ... Everybody has a little bag of rocks to Tote ... bd and I have seen these same type of posts and discussions go on about every 6 months for the last 16 years this web site has been in existence ... and it will go on for another 16 years as well ... <'TK>< :)

[Mike Anderson]

Then there's also an attitude of I eat every big fish I catch and I think it's funny so I brag about it publicly. I think I see that attitude peeking it's nasty little head out here too.


There is a younger generation that would love a shot at big browns. Like this guy who got this one on a fly on his first fly fishing trip with me.
http://www.trophyfishingtn.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/DSC09373.jpg
I take kids like this out all the time.

Check out the look on his face. He'll never forget this day. We need more of this and catch and release is the only way to assure it will be there always.
http://www.trophyfishingtn.com/coppermine/albums/userpics/DSC09391.jpg

Sitting on the same fish day in day out with live bait, cast nets, cranks or flies, catching the alpha fish and eating them is selfish plain and simple.

[jad2t]

And Jimmy I agree with you. If you catch, photograph, and post a photo of a 24" brown trout and then post photos of it in the frying pan, you WILL BE castigated, spit on, called many unsavory names, have your sanity questioned, be labeled an eco-terrorist, and unjustly be stricken from many sportsmen's invite list.

Myself on the other hand would ask you if it was delicious and were you thinking of sharing!

And that's why I like to go fishing with you!

[jad2t]

Jimmy, first of all, you are a great person, I enjoyed fishing with you and look forward to doing so again in the future, but there is a large difference in keeping a 24" trout in the caney or a 20" smallie from center hill than keeping a 20" smallie from a small stream, there might only be one 20" smallie in a 1 mile section of that stream, once it's gone, it's gone. There are several large trout in the caney and large bass in our reservoirs, but the small streams, which was the original topic in this thread, can and will get fished out if people keep the bass they catch there.

As far as the 24" brown, eat away. There are several in the river and most of the general public will probably not catch many if any at all. 99% of the few guys who can consistently bring in big browns are releasing them. I said 99%, I know some do eat them. I have tried to catch big brown for a whole, I have gotten several from 18-23 1/2", none over 24 yet.


Again I have absolutely no problem with keeping a limit of anything....until I see you walking up the bank of a 20' wide stream dragging a limit of bass.....just my 2 cents:)

I had a blast with you and Merv that day. Me and Merv have fished several times since then and after I graduate in May I plan to meet and fish with several more of the members here so that soon I'll have a Rolodex of fishing buddies!

I'm not saying I'd actually go to a tiny stream in search of a limit of bass. I don't do much exploring of small streams...yet. I'm sure there are some treasures hidden away with some great fishing but if I was going after a limit of bass, which I often do, I would go to a big lake, not a stream. I don't know that people would consistently target a tiny stream for food and be able to keep catching limits until it's depleted but I could be wrong.

As a guy who loves to eat fish (the worshipped trout and bass included), I realize that on this forum I'm about as popular as my Conservative politics would make me in San Francisco. My beef really isn't with guys not wanting someone to habitually hit tiny streams and take 5 bass home every time they go because I agree. Even if I was to take home that keeper brown out of the Caney, or a 20" smallie out of Center Hill, I'd be bombarded for it and that's just ridiculous. We all have our beliefs of eating or not eating fish and nobody on here should be ridiculed for their habits.

And to you Mike - If you're so concerned about people depleting your middle TN streams, why take them on guided trips there? Do you really think some of them don't come back, now that they know your hot spots, and fish for food if they so desire?

[jad2t]

There is a younger generation that would love a shot at big browns.

Sitting on the same fish day in day out with live bait, cast nets, cranks or flies, catching the alpha fish and eating them is selfish plain and simple.


And the younger generation will always have a shot at them because TWRA keeps stocking fish in the Caney as well as trout fisheries all over Tennessee.

Trout in the Caney are not your pets, saying it's selfish to enjoy eating them is beyond ridiculous. There is no attitude about bragging on eating big fish, not with me. I don't catch many trophy fish. I did catch a 7lb largemouth a few years ago, best one yet. Guess where it went? In the cooler. That wasn't the least bit selfish. Just for the record, I have yet to catch a keeper brown in the Caney. Biggest so far was 22 inches caught in pitch black, not a soul around. I could have kept it and nobody ever would know but I did the right thing and threw it back. I respect the rules. Had it been 2 inches longer, without hesitation it would have been destined to be cooked in my famous picatta recipe and I wouldn't have felt an ounce of guilt. I sure do like to eat the 12 inchers though!

You sentence calling me selfish because I would absolutely eat a 24 inch brown trout is exactly the attitude that we need less of in our community of outdoorsmen.

[Mike Anderson]

Reread what I posted.

Sitting on the same fish day in day out with live bait, cast nets, cranks or flies, catching the alpha fish and eating them is selfish plain and simple.

[Mike Anderson]

And to you Mike - If you're so concerned about people depleting your middle TN streams, why take them on guided trips there? Do you really think some of them don't come back, now that they know your hot spots, and fish for food if they so desire?

For starters Trout aren't my pets and the middle tn streams aren't my streams so I'd appreciate it if you'd stop projecting that attitude towards me. It turns a legitimate discussion into a pissing match. No need in that. I don't think I came across that way and if somehow I did,, I didn't mean to.

My comments about the attitude was because of this post.
"Gee thats too bad; I haven't eaten one of those bad boys since sunday".

I guide because fishing has been a passion of mine all my life. I enjoy passing it on to another generation insuring it will be here for my future generations.

I eat Trout too. I'm just selective about the ones I eat vs the ones I let swim. Eating the holdover Trout from a tailwater with tons of predators is counter productive if you enjoy catching holdover trout. But hey,, what do I know...

[jad2t]

I meant the other Mike, the one who guides for smallmouth.

[tkwalker]

I meant the other Mike, the one who guides for smallmouth.

Jimmy, Mike anderson is a pro Guide ... Are you referring to Mike (MNFISHER) I don't think he guides .. But He May ? <'TK>< :confused:

[jad2t]

No I meant Creeksmallie. His name is Mike isn't it?

[tkwalker]

No I meant Creeksmallie. His name is Mike isn't it?

Yes he is the premo Pro True Creek Guide !! and we mean wadable creeks . No boats for Mike ... <'TK>< ... Uck ... Snakes and things :eek:

[bd-]

A few thoughts:

1. After getting some requests by PM, I have reconsidered what I said before, and I deleted the name of the creek. I should have done it from the beginning. I would have deleted the whole thread, but there are other things being discussed here, so it seems like a reasonable compromise.

2. Most (not all) of our small creeks in Middle Tennessee are relatively clean. There are a few exceptions, but for the majority of creeks, fishing pressure will cause a lot more damage than pollution.

3. The accusation is getting thrown around that I am against anybody keeping fish, ever. That's not true in the least. I like to keep fish regularly myself. That said, I am strictly catch-and-release when bass fishing small creeks, because those fisheries are very vulnerable to fishing pressure. On a lake, if you catch a big bass and keep it, another comparable fish will come along and occupy its place fairly soon. In a creek, it may be a couple years before another fish grows into that niche, in that particular hole.

4. Yes, I also encourage turning trophy fish loose. We revere trophy fish because they are special - a rare combination of genetics and luck. I'd rather keep a few smaller fish and let the big one go, to let someone else have a shot at it too. If someone catches a fish of a lifetime and wants to keep it, I have no problem with that. But there are guys who have nothing else to do but put a lot of time in on the water, catch large numbers of trophy-class fish, and kill a whole lot of them. I am not a big fan of that, and I think the "meat hunter" designation is very appropriate.

5. As far as Jadt2 - with all due respect, just because it's legal statewide to keep five bass a day doesn't mean it's harmless to keep those five bass a day from a small creek. Yeah, one guy keeping five bass one time doesn't hurt anything. But direct half the Internet to that creek and let a bunch of people keep five bass a day over the course of a season, and it'll take years for that creek to recover. Small creeks and lakes are not the same.

6. It's not just about "Asians and Mexicans." I hate poachers and cast netters as much as the next guy, and I've got TWRA programmed into my phone so I can call when I see the nets being thrown. But a white guy stressing a resource with no respect for what it can sustain can cause problems just as easily.

bd

[bd-]

Sitting on the same fish day in day out with live bait, cast nets, cranks or flies, catching the alpha fish and eating them is selfish plain and simple.

Agreed. With emphasis on the day in, day out.

A guy who catches and keeps one or two 24" browns or one 20" smallie in a season doesn't have a measurable impact on a fishery.

The guy who is out there once or twice a week, pretty much all year, killing several dozen or more trophy fish every season, year after year - that guy has an undeniable impact on a fishery.

[MNfisher]

Well said BD, I agree 100% with everything you said there!

[jad2t]

Can't we all just get along?

[MNfisher]

Can't we all just get along?

Haha! There will never be common agreement in this topic! In reality we still respect each other, fishermen just like expressing their opinions on this topic!

[creeksmallie]

Why do I guide? I guide because I love fishing. I guide on some very small bodies of water. Yes I do eat Rock Bass from time to time. I also guide to educate.
A Lot of my clients over 16 years (or so) of guiding catch some of there biggest smallmouth and I teach the value of catch and release. I like TK and Mike Anderson are selective on who we choose to guide. Yes I hope the client goes back and uses what I have taught them. These are not my creeks and most places I go anyone can wade without permission. At the gathering I showed a couple of folks maps of good spots (that I guide on) to fish but I am not going to post the map on here. I have a freezer full of fish but I have not kept smallies in a long time just my preference.
When I was In college I would keep alot of fish. It was easy to wade the creek and come out with 20 Rock Bass and 5 smallies in a couple of hours. I also screwed up (Over harvested)some good holes because the fish do not move much in the summer unless there is a good rise and the water stays up for a while. So I fished the same stretch and wondered why I am not catching fish. They were in My belly.LOL I have witnessed legal and illegal citizens with sienes and keeping everything and the holes will not replenish till spring. I log a lot of hours on the streams and fish the same stretches sometimes 3 and 4 times a week in the spring and summer with good catch rates. I rarely see another fisherman. I was guilty of naming some streams and sections on the internet( when I started guiding) and did see more people in the mentioned sections and did see the catch rates go down to zero. So from my experience I do not name the streams on a public forum. I am sorry I stirred up a can of worms there are some great comments in here. If anyone wants to mention stream names gps coordinates eat 20 inch smallies from said stream, keep there legal limit out of the small creeks that is fine but they will see the catch rates go down.I like to catch more than I like to eat. I remember one Late August day I was exploring a section of stream I had never fished and caught what I thought was a 20 incher and a 8 or 9 in the 13 to 17 inch range from one rootball. I called BD up and took him the next week and he caught the 20 incher which we measured from the same spot. I got to watch a former client and now friend catch a true stream trophy and that is rewarding and why I guide.
I am done with this thread going to paint some sauger jigs for next week.

[Doc Marshall]

Ok, I guess I'll go to ***** ****** Lake instead. Beforehand, I'll go to **** *** Shop for some ***** to catch plenty of ****. PM me for *******.

******!

[MNfisher]

Ok, I guess I'll go to ***** ****** Lake instead. Beforehand, I'll go to **** *** Shop for some ***** to catch plenty of ****. PM me for *******.

******!

Percy Priest
Bass Pro
Lures
Bass
FishOn

You can't fool me :D

[bd-]

Ok, I guess I'll go to ***** ****** Lake instead. Beforehand, I'll go to **** *** Shop for some ***** to catch plenty of ****. PM me for *******.

******!

Sorry, Doc. I had several requests to cut the name of the creek, but I didn't want to delete your entire thread. Best compromise I could achieve.

If you have concerns or objections, feel free to PM me.

bd

[tkwalker]

Percy Priest
Bass Pro
Lures
Bass
FishOn

You can't fool me :D

He is also is into Crypto !!! <'TK>< :eek:LOL LOL LOL

[MNfisher]

He is also is into Crypto !!! <'TK>< :eek:LOL LOL LOL

Lol!!

[Doc Marshall]

No sweat, BD. All good. I just didn't expect an innocent question about a creek to blow up in my face like a trick cigar(!).

But now MNFisher knows where I shop for lures....

[MNfisher]

But now MNFisher knows where I shop for lures....

It took all of my college education and more to figure that out. Lots of hours trying to break your secret code.

[nofish]

This thread gives good reasons not to name names or specific locations where you fish and was edited by bd I believe to protect a creek.

[agelesssone]

TK, don't let MN fool ya. He had his lovely wife Jenn figure it out for him!